lest was in irland los ist
lest was die katholischen kinderschänder und kindermörder angerichtet haben
lest
UND TUT ETWAS DAGEGEN!
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Religious-orders-allowed-over-2000-Irish-children-to-be-used-in-medical-experiments.html [*quote*]
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Religious orders allowed over 2,000 Irish children to be used in medical experimentsPatrick Counihan @irishcentral June 07,2014 04:03 AM
A new report has revealed that more than 2000 Irish children living in religious run homes in the 1930s were subjected to drugs trials. More than 2000 Irish children in religious run homes were subjected to drugs trials in the 1930s according to a shocking new report.
As the Tuam burial ground scandal
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/The-Home-babies-in-the-news-A-timeline-of-neglect-in-plain-sight.htmlerupts, it has now emerged that Catholic Church run homes and state institutions let the children of unmarried mothers be used in medical experiments.
The Irish Daily Mail
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2650475/More-mass-baby-graves-Ireland-Prime-Minister-Enda-Kenny-orders-investigation-memorial-800-dead-babies-planned.htmlhas published a damning report which outlines how scientists secretly vaccinated more than 2,000 children in religious-run homes in suspected illegal drug trials.
The paper says that old medical records show that 2,051 children and babies in Irish care homes were given a one-shot diphtheria vaccine for international drugs giant Burroughs Wellcome between 1930 and 1936.
The report adds that no evidence exists that consent was ever sought.
Historian Michael Dwyer who unearthed the documentations says that no records of how many may have died or suffered debilitating side-effects as a result are in existence.
Irish Prime Minister Enda Kenny,
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Mass-grave-at-Tuam-Childrens-Home-not-the-only-one-says-Kenny.htmlon a trade mission in America, has been made aware of the scandal by the paper and has ordered ministers to see whether there are more mass baby graves scattered across the country.
His move comes after claims that more than 800 infants may be buried in a septic tank outside a former mother and baby home in Tuam.
Kenny confirmed: “I have ordered my officials to see what the scale is, what’s involved here, and whether this is isolated or if there are others around the country that need to be looked at.”
Dwyer, a lecturer at Cork University’s School of History, told the Irish Daily Mail that he found the child vaccination data by trawling through tens of thousands of medical journal articles and archive files.
He said the trials were carried out before the vaccine was made available for commercial use in the UK.
Irish homes
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Manslaughter-claim-in-deaths-of-800-children-in-Galway-unwed-mothers-Home-VIDEO.htmlwhere children were secretly tested included Bessborough, in Co. Cork and Sean Ross Abbey in Roscrea, Co. Tipperary, both of which are at the centre of the mass baby graves scandal.
The paper names other institutions where children may also have been vaccinated including Cork orphanages St Joseph’s Industrial School for Boys, run by the Presentation Brothers, and St Finbarr’s Industrial School for Girls, run by the Sisters of the Good Shepherd.
Dublin trials may have involved children from St Vincent’s Industrial School, Goldenbridge, St Joseph’s School for Deaf Boys, Cabra, and St Saviours’s Dominican Orphanage.
Dwyer warned: “What I have found is just the tip of a very large and submerged iceberg.
“The fact that no record of these trials can be found in the files relating to the Department of Local Government and Public Health, the Municipal Health Reports relating to Cork and Dublin, or the Wellcome Archives in London, suggests that vaccine trials would not have been acceptable to government, municipal authorities, or the general public.
“However, the fact that reports of these trials were published in the most prestigious medical journals suggests that this type of human experimentation was largely accepted by medical practitioners and facilitated by authorities in charge of children’s residential institutions.”
A spokesman for GSK -formerly Wellcome – told the Irish Daily Mail: “The activities that have been described to us date back over 70 years and, if true, are clearly very distressing.
“We would need further details to investigate what actually took place, but the practices outlined certainly don’t reflect how modern clinical trials are carried out. We conduct our trials to the same high scientific and ethical standards, no matter where in the world they are run.”
A spokeswoman for the Sisters of Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary, the order that ran Bessborough and Sean Ross Abbey, has said that like GSK, they would also welcome an independent inquiry.
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169 CommentsKATHY
21 hours ago
This reminds me of the horrific experiment on African American men and syphilis in the U.S. (1932-1972)......and they were left untreated. Just do an internet search of the key words in the previous sentence and you'll read about it: these men were never told they had the disease or that penicillin would make them better (after 1947). They were laboratory rats.
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Dale Carselli
1 day ago
Ah! the sanctity of life rears it's ugly head.
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Brian Maccaba
1 day ago
The Irish Tuskegee ?
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sean lavin
2 days ago
Ms Moore!! maybe you could volunteer to test some drugs preferably a drug that would give you some empathy. Eamonn from laois the church is knee deep in this scandal they visited these institutions and wore blinkers to absolve themselves. the hypocrites.
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Sara Knight
2 days ago
Priest stole €4,000 from church collection for social evenings -
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/priest-stole-4000-from-church-collection-for-social-evenings-29924337.html
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Slit Robo
2 days ago
The Church isn't responsible for any of this because they were all off duty with they drugged all those kids.
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2 replies
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Jeannie Reardon Medwid
2 days ago
How do you know they were off duty? I would think a home for children would be staffed round the clock...
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1 reply
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Eamonn Gavin
21 hours ago
Jeannie - Slit's comment is called "irony".
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coilin owens
2 days ago
I expect to find out, any day now, that there's been a Catholic cover up of the role that nuns have for a long time been playing in setting up drug mules from Peru, carjackings in Dublin, and illegal transgender operations.
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pmurraymusic
2 days ago
This is more depressing than surprising. Also, a very 'spun' recounting of the facts. As a dualist, it isn't difficult for me to see the duplicity in these events. I would surmise that in the minds of those who conducted these vaccinations based their precedent on the notion that if successful, the diphtheria vaccine could be used to eliminate the disease in developed nations across the world. However, the for-profit conglomerates behind the manufacturing and testing of said medications and their collusion with Catholic-based organizations automatically puts a questionable, negative spin on the events themselves. The fact remains that if the graves being uncovered now are in direct relation to these instances, with no documented account of their creation or the identity of the deceased, and there was a circumvention of guardian consent on the part of the pharmaceutical syndicates, there really is no defensible argument behind the possible mass disposal of "trial failures." For subsidiary/auxiliary organizations of the RCC to somehow be able to be "unaware" of this kind of eugenics-based collateral damage, when the Church itself is a staunch, stringent advocate for Life, it begs the question of how much knowledge or control their divisions have over their vast spheres of influence, as well as the moral values of their subordinates and affiliates.
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Fiona Moore
2 days ago
The drugs had to be tested somehow?
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5 replies
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Tim Hourigan
2 days ago
And would you volunteer yourself, or is it just cool to use the most vulnerable members of society?
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Colleen Morris
2 days ago
theres plenty of so called humans around then @ now that cud be used
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FurphyHaruspex
2 days ago
How are you not able to understand the fact that using children for medical experimentation is wrong? How could anyone be that devoid of basic ethical reasoning?
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Jeannie Reardon Medwid
2 days ago
Are ye feckin kidding me???
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Steve Kolpime
1 day ago
is that a direct quote from mengele or are you paraphrasing?
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Patty
3 days ago
Why is this a surprise to anyone?
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Ann Shannon
3 days ago
The sad, ugly truth is that civilization is a paper thin veneer for all of us. Individual and collective insanity sits right below the surface of the human mind and our civility. Human beings are deeply unconscious and blind to that unconsciousness in ourselves. We are all subject to our own little corners of prejudice and hatred, and we project that out on to others at an unimaginable cost in human suffering. The planet is being eaten alive by that pathology. We all need to look at ourselves as well as the Catholic church, and those in the past. If someone stokes our fear and bigotry in just the right place, we are all capable of anything. Until we reckon with that, and stop seeing the problem as "them" or "out there", we will always be finding new mass graves of slaughtered innocents. Blessings to all those sweet young souls. May heaven help us awaken so that all this carnage and cruelty comes to an end.
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Ann Shannon
3 days ago
of course, the truth needs to be investigated and brought fully to light, with legal consequences to all involved, but let's also examine the universal darkness in the human heart that gives rise to crimes like this.
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David Calvani
14 hours ago
Ann, your comment is the truest one I've ever read on any comment board.
Given our continuing drive for ever more powerful technologies I fear for the future if the human race doesn't wake up.
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sean lavin
3 days ago
why is my post been rejected I did not use swear words and IC are asking me to moderate my comments!! I will rewrite my post. The Christian churches, local councils and TD's of the period are responsible for safe-guarding children in orphanages. The authorities failed to keep minimum health standards and thus failed in their duty of care and the health Dept. (1930-1936) allowed illegal drug testing on institutionalised children. The mean-spirited few below making excuses for these Nuns. Priests, public servants and politicians would rather live in ignorance and wish it would all go away.
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George Thomson
3 days ago
How about, instead of playing the 'blame game.' folks demand a public inquiry and then wait for the findings? Not as exciting, I realize, and far less fun then bashing one side or, the other but, it would be the proper thing to do. Ghandi is quoted as saying, 'when you point a finger at another, there are four pointing back at you...." Let the truth come out and then there will be lots of blame for all.
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1 reply
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
You can't dodge the truth forever. Sad try though.
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Ganga Wonluv
3 days ago
An outright lie by GSK, they were fined in the largest EVER corporate case only 2 years ago 2012 selling illegal drugs to be used on children untested, unlicensed and the case came to light because these kids were killing themselves in droves. They used false test results and bribed doctors. The fine $3billion and no GSK criminals involved have faced criminal charges, they hide behind a legal system that protects corporate criminals. They routinely test drugs on children and adults in psychiatric settings and again are protected by a criminal legal system. These guys are distressed they got caught again and it may hit their profits. Human life means nothing to them.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-18673220Like
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2 replies
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
Fascinating and relevant. Thank you.
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Jac ....
2 days ago
The drugs weren't untested, but unlicensed for use with children, the doctors who prescribed the drugs are just as culpable, in fact more so as they took bribes to do so
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Bob McBride
3 days ago
The church has dirty hands in all of Ireland. Nobody has benifitted from the sectarian violence except the people who sell arms. The church was abusing and killing and molesting our orphans. Who owned burroughs and welcome at the time? Which illuminati family, was it the defence minister's?
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Marion Murphy
3 days ago
I am not shocked or surprised because history has repeated itself in recent times too. In the 70's we had mothers with newborns been knownly & deliberately injected with contaminated blood products & no law suite taken against the drug company leading to them developing Hep C also in recent times Mins James Reilly signed an indemnity allowing the drug company that produced the swine flu injection & continued to inject our children even though the WHO stated they had raised a false alarm, Now we have people suffering from narcolepsy.
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/state-indemnified-drug-firm-behind-swine-flu-vaccine-26726426.htmlLike
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Maureen Watson Powell
3 days ago
This is reminiscent of Hitler,experimenting on innoncent children.
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3 replies
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Eamonn Gavin
3 days ago
It happened - LEGALLY - all over the whole world, Maureen. Yes, very, very, sad.
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2 replies
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chris Don
2 days ago
So will we find more mass graves in those countries too shortly?
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1 reply
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Eamonn Gavin
21 hours ago
Already found them, Chris.
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Garry Otton
3 days ago
There's more...
http://scottishsecularsociety.com/how-low-can-the-catholic-church-go/Like
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Michael Reilly
4 days ago
And while allegations of “malnutrition” and “mistreatment” are being tossed about with reckless abandon, no supporting documentation has been provided that even hints at abuse at the hands of the nuns.
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8 replies
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Tim Hourigan
3 days ago
hundreds of death certs listing malnutrition and starvation would beg to differ with you. PRevious dail debates citing a far higher mortality rate inside the institutions than among the general population would beg to differ with you, and survivors of these institutions would beg to differ with you. In short, reality differs from your knee jerk defense of Holy Mother Church.
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5 replies
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Lizzy Anne
3 days ago
Many of the causes of death given are diseases which could now be treated by antibiotics or prevented with vaccination, also when someone dies of diseases like TB they gradually lose weight. So bodies which are unusually thin don't, of themselves, prove starvation. Keeping children in institutions with the over-crowding and presumably lack of personal clothing, linen etc as well as lack of good nutrition endangers children. Once exaggerations start to be written about the extent of the horror of children's graves not being marked with their names, the real victims, the children and mothers, lose out to those with an agenda. Also the real heroine of this story, historical researcher Catherine Corless is quoted in the Irish Times of Saturday 7/6/14 complaining of misrepresentation, for example states; "I never used the word 'dumped'."
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1 reply
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Tim Hourigan
2 days ago
So she didn't use the word 'dumped'. Would it be less of a scandal if 796 children died and were 'gently placed' into unmarked graves? If the place was riven with TB, or 'consumption' as it was called at the time, it would have been quarantined.
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Mark O'Sullivan
3 days ago
lol, the religious are well practiced in holding reality defying beliefs! They call it faith!
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2 replies
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Patricia Ann
3 days ago
And those who hate the faith are loathe to do any due diligence and would rather heap on the vitriol to support their visceral anger and position.
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1 reply
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
Exactly the sort of smug, blinkered superiority to others which leads to extactly what we're discusssing.
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
Really Michael. So who did it, if not the people in control from start to finsh and top to bottom?
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Grace Rose
2 hours ago
records exist of reports from govt inspectors of severe malnutrition, and severe neglect. there was. abuse and the children were left to die alone; our very own dying rooms. then they were dumped in unconsecrated ground.
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Michael Reilly
4 days ago
I detect the stench of a rat; an Irish rat with an anti-Catholic axe to grind. If this blockbuster wannabe scandal from the Emerald Isle tells us
anything it’s that fuel designed to ignite the fires of hatred for the
Catholic Church remains a hot commodity. The grave itself, in spite of the tenor of media reports, is not some recent “shocking discovery;” in fact, it’s not even news. According to a Reuters News Service , the grave was discovered some 39 years ago. It’s entirely possible that the mass grave was used as an attempt to keep infection levels in check
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3 replies
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Tim Hourigan
3 days ago
Of course, there are no legitimate cases, so it's all a political agenda right Michael? It's not the method of the burial, but the circumstances of their deaths have have been recently discovered.
Your strawman allegations hold as much sway as Mao denouncing critics as simply being 'anti-regime'. The Church has earned the shame being heaped upon it. It terrorised generations, covered up abuse, stole children, sold some, made slaves of others, and profited handsomeley. The order that ran this institution now run a large private healthcare firm.
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Mari Steed
3 days ago
And it's not just the graves of dead infants, Michael, but the entire history and culture of the mother-baby homes in Ireland, adoption, and all that goes with it. It's the largest, dirtiest piece of carpet still remaining to be ripped up in Ireland. Of course it's not "news" - it's been covered before. But 800 dead babies in Tuam may be what it takes to shock the sheeple and the government in Ireland into addressing what it should have been addressed back in 1999 under the Laffoy Commission. While you may be complacent and bored with such "old" news, 60,000 of us live it every day.
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
Michael, fashion a tinfoil hat as soon as humanly possible.
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sean lavin
4 days ago
The shameful illegal acts perpetrated on Irish children must be addressed. We now know that a protestant home and numerous catholic homes were involved in this cruelty. This shameful affair hangs over us all, especially for the survivors of these torture camps.
Closure must be sought or the hearts and minds of all Irish people will be tortured as an Irish person. I feel so ashamed and embarrassed. and I find it hard to understand such cruelty.
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1 reply
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Maggie Malone
2 days ago
I agree with you that this matter needs to be addressed in Ireland.
My heart bleeds for these poor little mites, abandoned by everyone. I'm also interested as to why a system of caring became such a cruel and uncaring system. There must have been a reason.
I often felt after growing up in a Catholic run boarding school during the 1940s and 1950s that the nuns treated us harshly, sometimes cruelly, because they were also treated harshly and sometimes cruelly. Often young nuns arrived bright and happy looking and over the years slowly looked ground down. There must have been something wrong within the whole Sisters of Mercy (and many other Religious Orders).
I hope that reasons are brought to light as to why Christian kindness and forgiveness, became warped in such a way. I feel for the families of these children and infants too, but would like to see the light of publicity brought to bear until a real investigation shows the reasons that produced such awful outcomes.
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Anonymous
4 days ago
Sounds like what the New York State Institution was doing to young handicapped children in the 60's and 70's!
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coilin owens
4 days ago
Read all about it!
IC reveals the truth about Irish Catholic cannibalism!
No story is shocking enough!
Impressionable vulgarians rally round!
Lead on O'Dowd!
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2 replies
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
I am so embarrassed for you right now.
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Kate Hillier
2 days ago
You are a maniac.
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coilin owens
4 days ago
I have a trove of letters from the Irish Sisters of Charity, Connaught Province from the 1930s that imply these sensational bits of news:
they were sending around, through the post, limbs of dismembered babies to convents all over Mayo and Roscommon
they were murdered under the highest standards of hygiene and secrecy
these packages contained recommended methods of cooking the choicest portions for Sunday dinner
the best specimens, these notes indicate, were fathered by Catholic curates!
lots of other spicy details!
I am offering Irish Central these SENSATIONAL letters!
Price negotiable.
If interested, contact me at cowens7@gmu.edu
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2 replies
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Tim Hourigan
3 days ago
Well, the papers seemed to have regurgitated wholesale the fiction that the Church cherished us all and was merely looking out for us, so if you want to point fingers at dishonest journalism, go right ahead.
Trying to strawman the critics only makes you look like a knee-jerking defender of a corrupt power hungry institution. Hundreds of death certificates for children listing malnutrition and starvation as cause of death... that's not loving care.
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
Nurse! Nurse! The screens! He's gotten out again!
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Hilda Whitson
4 days ago
Of course people use it to attack the Catholic Church. Completely ignoring that doing this was accepted SCIENTIFIC practice, and carried out by SCIENTISTS.
And they were doing the same thing in institutions that WEREN'T run by the Catholic Church. Completely secular mental homes were subjecting the mentally ill to electric convulsions. They were cutting out pieces of peoples' brains and turning them into vegetables. Britain didn't actually outlaw lobotomies until the 1970s.
So how come nobody is attacking scientists for their excesses and certainty in their own ideas that harms other human beings?
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9 replies
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Phillip Mooney
4 days ago
These were innocent children for goodness sake who were not able to give their consent. They were used as guinea pigs authorized by what appears to be sociopathic nuns who were NOT looking out for their welfare and just didn't care about them because they were the offspring of out of wedlock women a cultural faux pax.
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4 replies
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mary bryant
4 days ago
According to research of the whO records there were quite a few epidemics in Ireland through the late 50's..polio...diphtheria ....the former the vaccine arrived in Ireland in 1957,.. According the the year 1947 records, in Ireland 500 children (under age of 5) per day succumbed to measles, cholera, diphtheria and polio...Parents with children were lining up to be part of the experimental drugs because death by diphtheria and polio are wildly painful. I will wait for the facts....
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Hilda Whitson
4 days ago
Yes, they WERE innocent children, and the medical authorities and scientists said this was a GOOD thing.
“However, the fact that reports of these trials were published in the most prestigious medical journals suggests that this type of human experimentation was largely accepted by medical practitioners and facilitated by authorities in charge of children’s residential institutions.”
That's right there in the article. Reports that this was being done was published in prestigious, peer-reviewed medical journals. Notice, though, that the headline just says "Nuns did it."
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
They certainly permitted it. The children were their legal charges. Anything else I can clear up for you?
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Patricia Ann
3 days ago
Please tell me what child is able to give their consent. It is always an adult who is legally responsible for the child who gives consent for any medical procedure for a child so that comment holds no water.
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Mari Steed
4 days ago
Except that they never gained our mothers' consent. Our mothers were still our legal guardians at the time these trials were carried out, having not signed legal relinquishment. My mother testified to the Laffoy Commission in 2002 that she was never asked for her permission for my participation in the 1960-61 GSK/Burroughs Wellcome trial at Bessboro (I was able to confirm with GSK in 2011 that I was indeed part of the 'A' trial group, upon which 4-in-1 vaccine combos were tested). So yes, GSK was conducting legitimate scientific research. But the nuns were letting them in the door without mother's consent. What about this do you see as ethical?
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Tim Hourigan
3 days ago
Plenty of people attack Pharmaceutical companies for unethical behaviour. What's being pointed out here, is just who offered up the kids to them. Thankfully both corporate and theocratic power has been curtailed since then, but there should have been people jailed for this, regardless of where it occurred.
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John Lyttle
2 days ago
A Hilda by name and a Hilda by nature.
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Kate Hillier
2 days ago
You appear to be supporting the crimes being reported here. Are you a Catholic? If so - how - given all the evidence, how can you still support this brand of cover-ups, power and illegal behaviour?
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